Bula renitec 20 :34, 22 February 2015 (UTC) Incorrect If you can't say something is inaccurate, you can't even be right about that. Comment I'm sorry, but I think there is enough evidence here to suggest that Wikipedia is not in error: (a) it is consistent with the WP:NPOV and WP:NOT, which are the bedrock of WP's policy and guidance; (b) it is not the content of article but rather the way in which it is written that has been found to lack NPOV. What we have here is not an incorrect article per se. Rather it is a Wikipedia which violates NPOV, and so we must correct it. --Tumba 14:42, 22 February 2015 (UTC) It doesn't say that "This article is not about Islam or its issues. It is simply an article about the Koran, so you can ignore this part." As a non-Islam expert, I think that is a stretch. There nothing about the Koran that is sole subject of this article. As for ignoring the part about Quran, there's no problem with doing that. It is the manner in which we presented the information, and choice of words in its introduction which I think are at issue. If that was just an article about Islam, which one would do better? The that focuses on subject or the one that focuses on language? would be one thing. We are not discussing, by any stretch, Islamic culture. That's not a discussion that this article is trying to get us into; it is simply an article about the Bible. As is, this article appears to be an attempt create a conflict of interest in order to make the article more credible than Bible, which is the proper basis for Wikipedia discussion. A reasonable editor would see that the introduction of Koran is problematic at best, and a rather biased presentation at worst. This is because we seem to have created a double standard here, and one in which the Koran is not presented as an independent source of information but rather is seen as a source of information. I'm sorry for the above, but in a case as high profile this, one would expect the discussion to go at least somewhat differently; to include the issue of Koran as a source in its own merits rather than merely a way to cast aspersions, or a vehicle to get around policy and precedent, or simply out of a sense spite or an agenda to skew the content. And even that is not what's presented as being the case here. If article was going to have this focus, it would you get lasix over the counter be presented in this way; instead, the intent seems to have been present it in a biased way. is as if in an attempt to make the article more reliable, we have allowed our editorial control slip away. To go back the beginning, there are two parts in the introduction which are quite different. If you read the article carefully, you'll also notice that the first part says "It has been written that Muhammad was born into a wealthy family.... However, it is the Koran that provides sufficient historical and genealogical evidence to refute such claims." This seems to be a statement of what is meant. The second, and Lasix 120 Pills 100mg $99 - $0.83 Per pill in fact only part of the introduction we know of, is: "The Koran was dictated to Muhammad by Allah. It contains the true message of Allah," a statement which can't be made about Muhammad himself, who was not in the can lasix be bought over the counter first part. --Tumba 14:42, 22 February 2015 (UTC) That is my point; this an attempt to create a conflict of interest in which the Koran is presented as an independent source in and of itself an attempt to make the article more "reliable", not because its information is of any historical or scientific value. It is a complete misrepresentation of what we are talking about at this point to see the Koran presented as a source. If they had to rely on someone else provide the evidence Koran itself provides, that would be OK. However, we are dealing with a very biased description, not source. Wikipedia is a journal where the evidence is presented only so a source can be found. Wikipedia is a site for accurate information. This article simply doesn't present anything. In addition, no-one our group or among the community (which would include everyone from our peer reviewers and editor's in-house to those editors who work on other articles) have expressed an opinion on the legitimacy of Quran as a source or evidence. So unless one of those other editors can point to any information which would make it less biased, this is a pure opinion which cannot be used as evidence of its veracity. Tumba (talk) 15:07, 22 February 2015 (UTC) The article does not present Quran as a specific source, but rather describes the various meanings of Bible and how these have been used as.
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